If you have not read the article "The Breaking of Ouroborus" by Cyprium, i recommend beginning there before reading this, as much of what is written in this article will make better sense read second to this one.

The CERN LHC (large hadron collider) is a massive particle accelerator near Geneva Switzerland, costing 9 billion dollars to build. The goals of this machine are claimed to be aimed at understanding the answers to the fundamental questions of physics, including the hope of discovering the hypothetical Higgs boson. In theory, the Higgs boson, often called the "god particle", is a massive scalar elementary particle which gives all things mass. This particle would supposedly be the framework of all things existing in physicality.

The LHC intends to collide particles at a rate slightly under the speed of light and in the process will be potentially creating black holes, exotic matter and wormholes. The worried public has been reassured that nothing disastrous can occur from the experiments which they intend to do at CERN. It is assured, they say, that such things as black holes and wormholes would remain so incredibly small and exist for such a tiny fraction of time that they would be harmless and merely side effects of their intended goals.

So far, though the LHC has encountered many and strange interruptions which has prevented it from reaching it's full potential yet, it has already produced black holes.

"I can confirm that, yes, the first stages of the experiment resulted in the appearance of a miniscule black hole," said the spokesperson to gathered reporters on Monday. "The black hole is being kept under quarantine and our scientists have been monitoring its progression,"


CERN's large hadron collider is expected to produce wormholes as well. Wormholes are a means by which traveling through time is possible, though for one to be traversable it must be much larger than the subatomic size which CERN claims will be the only ones possible with their particle collider. The function of a wormhole can basically be understood by the analogy of piercing two ends of a piece of paper with a needle and then folding that paper so that those two holes connect. The necessity to travel across the paper's surface is bypassed, the paper itself representing time and space.

Two physicists, Irina Ya. Aref'eva, and Igor V. Volovich disagree with CERN's assurances that traversable wormholes are not the direction CERN is headed toward.

"We suggest that there is a possibility to test causality at the LHC. We argue that if the scale of quantum gravity is of the order of few TeVs, proton-proton collisions at the LHC could lead to the formation of time machines (spacetime regions with closed timelike curves) which violate causality. One model for the time machine is a traversable wormhole. We argue that the traversable wormhole production cross section at the LHC is of the same order as the cross section for the black hole production. Traversable wormholes assume violation of the null energy condition (NEC) and an exotic matter similar to the dark energy is required. Decay of the wormholes/time machines and signatures of time machine events at the LHC are discussed."


The LHC is now operating at 7 TeV (teraelecrtronvolts, 1TeV=i trillion electronvolts) with a stated goal of eventually reaching 14 TeV. It is argued that traversable wormholes could not be created on earth since the energy required would be something comparable to stellar explosions, though the amount of kinetic energy necessary to produce results of a certain kind within a collider are less than that required to produce the same results in space.

The formation of exotic matter would be necessary to the formation of a traversable wormhole as a result of the Casimir effect which is a sort of localized vacuum phenomena in which a mass negative region of space-time can exist. Exotic matter violates energy conditions, having negative mass or repulsion to gravity. At high enough energy of collision exotic particles can be formed and have been detected at the LHC.

Time in no straight line, it is a circuit and circuits repeat themselves. Why this should be is not questioned as much as whether it is but the fact that time is a circuit is observable with no doubt. It can be observed as simply as watching the eastern Horizon at sunrise on the morning of the Spring Equinox. As time passes, the sun rises through the houses of the zodiac in a circular pattern which eventually arrives back at it's beginning point. Why time exists in a cycling pattern is directly connected with the origin of sin and that there are beings, including Satan who are interested in maintaining a timepath which never exits into eternity and so to the judgment and defeat which is determined to them.

As these days give every sign of being the last days, Satan knows his time is short in a literal way. Knowing he will not be successful against the Most High, he knows that his chances only rest in a device to maintain or begin anew the next cycle. It would seem that this is what CERN"S Large Hadron Collider has been built to achieve. It is evident not only in the published science involved but the geometric design of the machine. CERN represents it's goals with a statue of Shiva. Shiva is a deity who represents death and rebirth, a being connected with the idea of a circuit of time which folds in on itself to meet end to beginning.

Octagonal Design

In Buddhism a symbolic object exists called a dharma wheel. It is an 8 spoked wheel that represents the noble 8-fold path to enlightenment. It is described as a way which leads to the ceasing of suffering and the achieving of a new and more enlightened consciousness which perhaps can be said to sound quite a bit like the promise of world peace in a "new world order".

The Dharma wheel is one version of the same symbolic reference in many occult traditions. An 8 spoked wheel was found in the tomb of William Sinclair at Roslyn Chapel in Scotland. The Sinclair family is known as one of the blue blood families which grew out of the Merovingian line with strong connections to the Templars and Freemasons. The Chapel was built to incorporate a great deal of Masonic and Templar symbolism. The 8 rayed star is the symbol of Ishtar, a human woman who was wife to a fallen Watcher and is considered a goddess by many names in many different pagan cultures. The octagon is found in Nazi symbolism and at the Vatican as well.

The symbolism of 8 and what its meaning is connected to a circle of time is found in an ancient inscription in Egypt.

"I am One who becomes Two,
who becomes Four,
who becomes Eight,
and then I am One again. "

8 is a number which universally symbolizes the new beginning following the close of a repetitive time sequence. The 8th day in weeks is also the first.

The design of certain components of the LHC will remind you of the symbols just spoken of.

The Aerial view of LHC will remind you of the Ouroborus

The Dharma wheel and 8 fold path is not simply a religious concept. Physics itself involves a theory called the the 8 fold way. This is a theory for organizing subatomic baryons (a composite particle made of three quarks) and mesons (made of one quark and one anti quark) into octets. Both of these particles belong to the hadron family.

It is most interesting to notice that the LHC has repeatedly been prevented from reaching it's intended potential by various strange circumstances which have even led some scientists to wonder if the machine was being sabotaged by itself from a future point or perhaps even time travelers who already understood the dangers of the thing. One occurrence was nothing more than a little bird who dropped a bread crumb into the machine. I believe it is neither the machine itself or time travelers but it is not coincidence either. I believe that YHWH Himself hinders their progress and it remains to be seen if there will come a point when He will allow them to attempt all that they design to do with it.

The latest thing to hinder the LHC's progress is an unknown vibration which they term "the Hump". It is a high frequency vibration between 31 and 38 KHz and has caused beam losses for the collider while in operation. CERN is not able to identify what the vibration is or where it might be coming from except that it either originates directly below or directly above the collider ring. It is just such a vibration as to cause the perfect means for disruption of the machine. It is my conclusion that He has drawn a line which will not be crossed except by His will at His timing if ever and even should this device accomplish to create a continued time loop, He has promised that His plan for eternity will not be thwarted.

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Just a few thoughts on time travel subject. When I think about time travel it comes to my mind what is written in 2 Cor.4v18 "things which are seen are temporary , but the things which are unseen are eternal"So it looks like time is a property of material things.We are taking about matter , but man is a spiritual being as well. Does he have the same property as matter? No. Another issue I have with time travel is That in order for man to travel forward or backward in time there has to be many  universes where we live parallel to this one. Is it possible , well I don't think  Our Lord created many parallel universes to unable us to time travel. Devil would use it to move back and prevent birth of our Lord Jesus Christ.11 chapter of epistle to Hebrews verse 3 states that visible  things were made out of invisible which is Word of God. So I think they will never find the so called particle of God, because as some scientists admitted it comes from another dimension.mbernat
"things which are seen are temporary , but the things which are unseen are eternal"So it looks like time is a property of material things.We are taking about matter , but man is a spiritual being as well. Does he have the same property as matter? No. "

If time were a phenomenon which effected only the material then all things spiritual must therefor be immune to it. As you said, man is not only body but spirit. That spirit is carried along by time in the same manner that the body is. The mind does not perceive the future, though it is an aspect of the spirit, nor can it return to the presence of the past in the natural mechanics of time. Man is both spirit and body, both of which are subject to the effects of a reality taking place in time.

"Another issue I have with time travel is That in order for man to travel forward or backward in time there has to be many  universes where we live parallel to this one. "

Parallel universes are not a necessity to time travel if time itself is a circuit. The existence of of multiple branches of time, whether they exist or not is not absolutely relevant to the possibility of travelling in time.

"well I don't think  Our Lord created many parallel universes to unable us to time travel. Devil would use it to move back and prevent birth of our Lord Jesus Christ."

In the hypothetical existence of multiple parallel universes, they would exist as a result of cause and effect, the numerous decisions made by created beings causing a new parallel with every possible solution. They would not have been created directly, much as He does not directly bring into existence the consequences of what we do. Time travel would never enable the Devil or anyone else to usurp His will. He is sovereign in this universe and every other one that could exist. His will is done no matter what we do.

If you have never heard of the "Philadelphia Experiment" of the 1940's, in which time travel did occur, here is a link to investigate it:




Hi Prodigal Son, well there are many things we don't know. I prefer to stick to the Bible than have a head full of what happened or what didn't happened in Philadelphia experiment.I have read about it many years ago, and it was portrayed as "bending of light" experiment, done mainly   by Tesla. You said "That spirit is carried along by time in the same manner that the body is.", how can you say it when we know that body will perish but spirit lives for ever."2Cor,ch 4 v16 our outward man is perishing, yet the inward man is being renewed day by day."This is not physics, it is a Law of our Lord. If there is reality in this world it is only in God. Let us trust Him in everything, caus "everything was created for Him and By Him, visible or invisible"Col 1 v16 mbernat
The reason we delve into things like the Cern LHC and its intended uses is to better grasp what the secular world controllers are doing and are planning to do in preparation for their "New World Order." That system which is in place now and will come to a full realization in the days of their leader is in the Bible... the indication of repeatetive time is in the Bible, so are references to the use of forbidden knowledge to further technological advances.

The fact that science and all its properties Belong to YHWH, and He created them flies in the face of the mainstream idea that those principles are directly opposed to Him. Understanding the big picture of what He is all about and His creation in past present and future is what we're all about. If it's reality, it matters...if reality is strange, it still matters....it's good to investigate everything.
Hello, Let us read Epistle to Heb.chap.1 v 10 You, Lord  in the beginning laid the foundation of the earth , and the heavens are the work of Your hands; they will perish , but You remain; And they will all grow old like a garment; like a cloak You will fold them up, and they will be changed. But You are the same . and  Your years will not fail. and 1 Epistle to Cor.1 v. 19 "I will destroy the wisdom of the wise, and bring to nothing the understanding of the prudent."
"You said "That spirit is carried along by time in the same manner that the body is.", how can you say it when we know that body will perish but spirit lives for ever."

Both the Spirit and the resurrected body of the redeemed will exist eternally when this temporal world is finished, yet both are now very much a part of time while it remains. If this were not so, the mind, which exists with the spirit would not be limited by time. The mind would operate in an eternal frame if the spirit was immune to time but we know that it does not.

Likewise, material things will exist in eternity. A new Heaven, a new Earth and all things in it, including the resurrected bodies of the redeemed will abide within an eternal non-temporal existence after time ceases. Spiritual things are not exclusive to eternity nor are material things exclusive to a temporal existence.
Hi Prodigal Son, you said  "Likewise, material things will exist in eternity."This is contrary to 2Cor ch.4 v 18. Epistle to Rom. 8v  21 says"because the creation itself also will be delivered from the bondage of corruption into the glorious liberty of the children of God."Every part of the Universe is corrupted and has to be changed verse 22 of the same chapter. And  the Lord will change it. I don't think it will be matter as we know. Everything is cursed and sin resides in our body so it has to be something totally new as the old passes away and there is no place found  for it. 2Pet. 3 v10, says"The day of the Lord will come as a thief in the  night , in which the heavens will pass away with great noise , and the elements will melt with fervent heat; both the  earth and the works that are in it will be burned  up. verse 12 "Verse 11 tells  us that visible universe will be destroyed (Greek word luo means "cease to exist")Also I always thought that mind is a  part of natural man not spiritual, Rom 12 v 2 "be transformed by renewing of your mind"refers to carnality of human mind that points to it as being part of carnal man. I understand mind as a media  between spirit and natural man that can be influenced either by God or by the world.mbernat

material things existing in eternity is evidenced many places in the bible.. a fact that is not contradicted by 2Cor.4:18 'While we look not at the things which are seen, but at the things which are not seen: for the things which are seen are temporal; but the things which are not seen are eternal.'


'temporal' in this verse is the Greek 'proskairos' which means 'temporary'.. this verse is speaking specifically on unseen treasures of glory which we store up in eternity, though we be here in this temporary world, enduring temporary affliction, as stated in the previous verse: 'For our light affliction, which is but for a moment, worketh for us a far more exceeding and eternal weight of glory' 2Cor.4:17


M. - Romans 8:21 states that the 'creature' itself shall also be delivered.. not 'creation' as you have written.. Rom.8:21 'Because the creature itself also shall be delivered from the bondage of corruption into the glorious liberty of the children of Yahuwah.' Verse 22 states 'For we know that the whole creation groaneth and travaileth in pain together until now.' 23 'And not only they, but ourselves also, which have the firstfruits of the Spirit, even we ourselves groan within ourselves, waiting for the adoption, to wit, the redemption of our body.'


'our body'.. a body is a material thing.. a material thing which can be corrupt or incorrupt.. redeemed or not redeemed.. earthly or heavenly..


in John 20 there is a good example of material in eternity..

the setting: Yahushua had been crucified, died, had His body wrapped and put in the tomb.. the tomb had been found empty, the disciples had left, but Mary Magdalene stayed behind and saw Yahushua before He ascended..

He was definitely 'material' at this point, because she mistook Him for the gardner (20:15).. which is interesting in itself, since Yahushua is called 'the last Adam' (1Cor.15:45), whereas the 'first man Adam' was a gardner himself, who was put 'into the garden of Eden to dress it and keep it' (Gen.2:15)

He had died and resurrected, but had not yet ascended..

'Yahushua said to her "Touch Me not; for I am not yet ascended to My Father: but go to My brethren, and say unto them, I ascend unto My Father.."' (Jhn.20:17)

interesting He tells her not to touch Him because He had 'not yet ascended'.. certainly he was material enough to be touched (not to mention mistaken for a gardner) but He had died.. and though He had risen, He had not yet ascended.. therefore His body had not yet been glorified.. so His body, at the point where Mary Magdalene sees Him, is still earthly flesh which had died.

'Mary Magdalene came and told the disciples..' (20:18)

'Then the same day at evening.. came Yahushua and stood in the midst, and said unto them "Peace unto you"' (20:19)

'And when He had so said, He showed them His hands and His side, then were the disciples glad when they saw the Master' (20:20)

Yahushua had died, risen and ascended..

'But Thomas was not with them..' (20:24)

'The other disciples therefore said unto him, we have seen the Master.' (20:25)

'But he said unto them, "Except I shall see in His hands the print of the nails, and put my finger into the print of the nails, and thrust my hand into His side, I will not believe."' (20:25)

Thomas is looking for material proof of Yahushua in His eternal physical state.. and he gets it 8 days later..

'And after eight days again His disciples were within, and Thomas with them: then came Yahushua, the doors being shut, and stood in the midst, and said "Peace unto you"' (20:26)

something to note here: the circumstances for the first and second sightings are the same.. the disciples are meeting in a room with closed doors.. a regular earthly-fleshed person would have needed to come through the doors to enter the room.. however, Yahushua came into the middle of the room after the doors were shut..

after His ascention, Yahushua appeared twice in the middle of a room with locked doors.. not something earthly flesh tends to do.. whereas after His resurrection, but before His ascention, He likely left the tomb through the doorway, since the stone covering of it had been removed.

back to Thomas and proof of material things in eternity..

'Then saith He to Thomas, "Reach hither thy finger, and behold my hands; and reach hither thy hand, and thrust into my side: and be not faithless, but believing."' (20:27)

'And Thomas answered and said unto Him, "My Master and my 'Eloah."' (20:28)

before His ascention, Yahushua did not allow Mary Magdalene to touch His body which had died, though it had been resurrected.. after His ascention, He tells Thomas to touch His body which had died, been resurrected - and which, after His ascention, had been glorified.

we can see from His contact with Thomas that not only was His body physically material, since Thomas was able to touch Him, but also that it was the same body of His that He'd had on Earth at His crucifixion, with the exact same wounds.. thus, a body restored to its incorrupt glory.. a vision of this glorified physical state is given in Luke 9 , Mar.9, and Matthew 17:

'Yahushua takes Peter, James, and John his brother, and brings them up into a high mountain apart, And was transfigured there before them; and His face did shine as the sun, and His raiment was white as the light.' (17:1,2)

His face was still His face, but glorified.. His clothing was the same clothing, but glorified.

the fact that Yahushua returned in His own physical and glorified body, after His ascention, is a good way to understand how there is 'material' in eternity.. the form which He had after His ascention is the same form He was in when He took His seat at the right hand of the Father in Heaven.. and speaking of taking His seat..

eternity includes many material items.. Yahuwah's throne.. His altar.. (Rev.8:3) the entire city of New Jerusalem (Rev.21:2).. which is quite physical, with measurements and gates and foundations (Rev.21:15-21).. the difference in everything being that those material items which exist in eternity are not polluted by corruption..

some items certainly have never seen corruption.. like His throne.. other material things have been delivered from corruption.. such as the people described here:

'After this I beheld, and, lo, a great multitude, which no man could number, of all nations, and kindreds, and people, and tongues, stood before the throne, and before the Lamb, clothed with white robes, and palms in their hands' (Rev.7:9)

'And one of the elders answered, saying unto me, What are these which are arrayed in white robes?' (Rev.7:13)

'..he said to me, These are they which came out of great tribulation, and have washed their robes, and made them white in the blood of the Lamb. Therefore are they before the throne of Yahuwah, and serve Him day and night in His temple: and He that sitteth on the throne shall dwell among them.' (Rev.7:14,15)

many material items in eternity.. and without those material items.. what would there be?


'a new earth' (Rev.21:1) sounds like a good material thing doesn't it? we see this 'temporal', this temporary earth.. and it is corrupt.. and we see our temporal selves, also corrupt.. but there will be a new earth.. an incorrupt earth.. and there will be new selves.. incorrupt selves.. the earth will still be material and we will still be material.. the difference being that we will be filled with the glory of our Creator, glorified bodies will still be bodies, just as Yahushua showed His glorified form to His disciples.. anything less just becomes 'floating orbs of light'..


the mind itself is a faculty belonging to the spirit.. it certainly cannot belong to the carnal flesh.. otherwise our Creator, who is spirit (Jhn.4:24), would not have one.. and our Creator has a mind with which He thinks (Isa.55:8) 'My thoughts are not your thoughts..' the mind cannot belong to the carnal flesh.


the spirit is where the mind resides.. 'I will put my laws into their mind..' (Hbr.8:10) 'mind' in this verse is the Greek word 'dianoia' which means 'mind, spirit, thoughts'.. if the mind perished with earthly corrupt flesh.. how would anyone think in eternity? But our Creator is in eternity.. and He thinks, and His thoughts are only pure.. and when we enter into eternity we will think also and our thoughts will be only pure also..


eternity is not a place really.. it is a condition.. just like 'temporal' or temporary is a condition.. our Creator is eternal.. and eternally is how we will reside with Him once this temporary time is finished.. and the enemy will do everything in his power to prevent that.. because when all of those who love Messiah are with Him in eternity.. it means the enemy who does not love Messiah will be eternally without Him..and the enemy will do anything to prevent his own eternal judgment - including manipulate the time-space continuum.


'wherefore gird up the loins of your mind (same Greek word: 'dianois'), be sober, and hope to the end for the grace that is to be brought unto you at the revelation of Yahushua the Anointed..' (1Pe.1:13)








Hello Bean. Reading "He was definitely 'material' at this point, because she mistook Him for the gardner (20:15). makes me lose interest in discussing it with You.It is unwise to say things like that because you don't know it. You  just go too far.  Contrary to it ,it is possible He was not(material) . When Bible speaks about resurrected body ,it is different to the one we know , as 1 Cor. 15 v51 says "Now this I say,brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the Kingdom of God, nor does corruption inherit incorruption.Behold I tell  you a mystery : We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed- in a moment " If You don't believe it you don't have to, this extract of the  Word of God doesn't need any interpretation, it is simple and straightforward , Christ's resurrected body was spiritual as verse 44 says,"it is sown a natural body, it is raised a spiritual body".Follower of Christ does not need special revelation to understand it, we need to believe it. Everything else in Kingdom of God is spiritual as our Father in Heaven is. And our transformed minds will become spiritual as well.Please read whole chapter 15 of 1 Epistle to Cor. mbernat


If the point is that time travel is impossible because all spiritual things are not included in time, that immediately has no grounds just based on the fact that we  can experience things which will continue eternally right now..within time.

Satan and other fallen angels are purely spirit....but do they have the ability to see the entire span of the future and into eternity? If so, they fight a war they already know they lost...they make mistakes in their strategy in spite of already knowing it was a mistake. Certainly they have a fallen nature, man's spirit also has a fallen nature...both are spiritual and both are subject to limitations of knowledge based on chronology.

At any rate i think the aim of this article was never to say that they Will Without Doubt be able to use the LHC as a time travel device...because that all depends on what the will of YHWH ultimately is. They are, however, Able to use it in that way if He is willing to allow it and it would be presumptuous to imagine that we know exactly what He will or will not allow in the last days.

Had He allowed it, those who built the tower of Babel would have achieved anything they imagined to do. We've already seen the enemy do things which would have only decades ago been called the stuff of science fiction.

It's definitely worth thinking about...but it's not necessarily worth arguing about. No one is getting into the Kingdom or left out of it based on how much particle physics they understood, were interested in or were right about. The main point is...be prepared for whatever happens and keep humble about what you're willing to assume is possible or not.
Hi Cyprium. well I don't think this article prepares believers in any way  for what is going to happen  in God's appointed time. What I know is , God is controlling time, and when the time is up He will come. 2Peterch 3 v 9 "the Lord is not slack concerning His promise". I rather base my trust in His word then speculation and pagan ideas. I cannot find any references in the Bible teaching us to use  pagan knowledge and occult tradition in our understanding  of end times or any other  aspects of Christian walk with God.. mbernat

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